Who wins?

[yuurei]

Both borgs are level 1 normal (Or alt if you prefer) colored borgs. The fight place can be anywhere. Lets say one area is completely flat with no obstacles while the other is again flat but has walls and things. Who wins where? Both borgs can be considered controlled by either humans playing at the highest level possible or computers playing at the highest level possible.

Personally i go for Ruby. His bomb's are quite good against other knights and he can block Saphs lazorz with his shield.

Opinions?

[Death Eye]

Sapphire Knight would win.
Ruby Knight's bombs aren't that hard to dodge, while the Mega Lance Beam is nearly impossible to dodge and not exactly an easy attack to block.

[yuurei]

I disagree about how its so hard to dodge/block. In my experience it's only hard to dodge if you aren't focusing on Sapphire knight. I also spend a large amount of time blocking thing all sorts of ranged attacks so i may be biased. Your right about Rubies bombshots being easy to dodge though.

[Dyrozix]

Why are we pitting two great borgs against each other
they should team up and take down Death eye

[dillybar64]

Jun 8, 2011 2:28:01 GMT yuurei said:

I disagree about how its so hard to dodge/block. In my experience it's only hard to dodge if you aren't focusing on Sapphire knight. I also spend a large amount of time blocking thing all sorts of ranged attacks so i may be biased. Your right about Rubies bombshots being easy to dodge though.

You are perfectly correct.
And with them focusing on each other they are going to block a majority of each others shots.
However, Ruby Knight has a special shield bomb ability that will never be useful if Sapphire Knight is played perfectly, and if Sapphire Knight is played perfectly they can wait for, or force, moments when he can use his big laser.


I would also like to point out that Sapphire Knight has stronger projectiles.
If it weren't for the fact that Ruby Knight cannot aim his explosive shots at Sapphire Knights feet, then I would have to say him. But he doesn't, so ugh...

[yuurei]

How can you force anything with a shield to get hit by The big beam though? All you have to do is face the Sapphire knight.

As far as i'm aware both knights have the same basic stats. Sure Saph could run as fast as Ruby could chase, but not while shooting at ruby. If Saph tries to shoot Ruby with its B lasers then it's not moving and Ruby is getting closer and if Saph tries to hit Ruby with it's X all Ruby has to do is fire off a quick Bbomb. The bomb comes straight out of the shield so you can still block with it. If Ruby gets hit then 9 times out of 10 the bomb hits Saph either at the same time as Saphs X beam hits Ruby or the bomb hits slightly after the beam.

Meanwhile a Ruby knight played perfectly would always be chasing Saph with air dashes while also being ready to block. It's not very difficult to block the X beam, you just have to keep facing Saph. In the end i think Saph could stall it out with the X beam. It just has too much knockback on block to ignore. But even with that knockback Ruby could make up for the distance lost while X charges back up again. I think Ruby would win in a melee fight because it has more options at close range (I mean the X bomb's of course.) They do suck, i'll admit that, but they cut off aggressive movement towards Ruby even if they do miss. The issue (In my mind) would be forcing Saph to hold still long enough to get hit by Ruby.

[Doublesuya]

Both, because they are that frikking awesome.

[dillybar64]

Jun 8, 2011 23:56:11 GMT yuurei said:

How can you force anything with a shield to get hit by The big beam though? All you have to do is face the Sapphire knight.

You hit when they cannot block.
Hit their dead side, the one holding the lance and not the shield.

Jun 8, 2011 23:56:11 GMT yuurei said:

As far as i'm aware both knights have the same basic stats.

No they don't.

Jun 8, 2011 23:56:11 GMT yuurei said:

Sure Saph could run as fast as Ruby could chase, but not while shooting at ruby. If Saph tries to shoot Ruby with its B lasers then it's not moving and Ruby is getting closer and if Saph tries to hit Ruby with it's X all Ruby has to do is fire off a quick Bbomb. The bomb comes straight out of the shield so you can still block with it. If Ruby gets hit then 9 times out of 10 the bomb hits Saph either at the same time as Saphs X beam hits Ruby or the bomb hits slightly after the beam.

You can move and shoot at the same time.
Also, Sapphire Knight's projectiles reload constantly, Ruby Knight only refills when his clip is empty.
Sapphire Knight has projectile advantage from hitting harder with them too.

Jun 8, 2011 23:56:11 GMT yuurei said:

Meanwhile a Ruby knight played perfectly would always be chasing Saph with air dashes while also being ready to block. It's not very difficult to block the X beam, you just have to keep facing Saph. In the end i think Saph could stall it out with the X beam. It just has too much knockback on block to ignore. But even with that knockback Ruby could make up for the distance lost while X charges back up again. I think Ruby would win in a melee fight because it has more options at close range (I mean the X bomb's of course.) They do suck, i'll admit that, but they cut off aggressive movement towards Ruby even if they do miss. The issue (In my mind) would be forcing Saph to hold still long enough to get hit by Ruby.

Again, keep away from Ruby Knight and you will not be hit by his shield bombs.
Strafe so you can hit him on his dead side with out the shield.
Ruby would win in a Melee Fight, but Sapphire would win range wise.
And when they both move at the same speed Ruby cannot close in, Sapphire wins.

[Frozazen]

okay, so since this will most likely be an aerial battle, the angle of the shields will be a very important factor, and both knights will be jumping around to get at that angle where their shots will hit. also since both of their close-ranged moves fail at life, or more accurately raise the risk level by a significant degree, we can assume that this will be a long-ranged battle with both knights jumping and dashing every which way.

Sapphire knight will be boosting around, shooting his bullets, dodging ruby knight's bombs and keeping his distance, shooting his small beams. when he sees a time in which he is higher than ruby knight, he will then close in to use his X, and that would give a ton of damage. and since his B shots have a pretty decent firing rate, some damage will be done, but since they move so slowly i wouldn't expect them to do much.

Ruby knight will also be boosting around, shooting at sapphire knight. since his shots are bombs, it only takes one hit to bring sapphire knight to the ground, when ruby knight can then shoot his bombs with sapphire knight's loss of speed. his X really isn't that good, so i'd just stick with shooting bombs. There is of course another tactic ruby knight could use, which is to wait for sapphire knight to get in his position and try to use his X, and ruby knight would then just sidestep and shoot bombs, or jump into the beam and block it with his shield, and shoot bombs from there.

i have noticed though that sometimes bombs have a way of wrapping their explosions around shields, and doing a bit of damage that way, so since sapphire knight only has beams, his shots are much easier to block, and his X beam, though dangerous, has an incredible amount of lag, which makes it a move that you would use at your own risk. Ruby knight, however, will probably not be using his X, maybe to put random bombs around the field, and even so it poses no danger to him, only to sapphire knight, who has to dodge those bombs, assuming ruby knight has good placement skills.

i would think that ruby knight would have the upper hand in this matchup, since he has bombs, and because sapphire knight has more of a chance to fail when he uses his X.

[yuurei]

The only difference i see between their stats is that Saph has a better Shot rating.

The dead side issue is easily corrected by turning slightly. Anyways ranged attacks naturally aim dead center for a borg. The center of Ruby (And Saph) is covered by their shield.

And yes you can move and shoot at the same time. But you can't airdash backwards and fire toward a enemy at the same time. So if Saph is firing at Ruby, Ruby is moving toward Saph faster then Saph is moving backwards. And if Saph is airdashing away while Ruby is chasing then Saph is leaving itself wide open to a shot from behind. If Saph is on the ground then Ruby is in the air moving towards it faster than it moves on the ground.

Saphs shots doing more damage is moot seeing how easy it is to block them. (Moot is a actual word? Weeeird.) Unless you mean by hitting harder you mean the knockback from the shots is more then average. I don't think it has more knockback than normal though. If anything Rubys would have more knockback due to the explosion and the bullet itself hitting the shield.

Basically, Saph wins if Ruby can't block. There's no way for ruby to not be blocking because ruby rarely leaves itself open. (Or at least a well played Ruby anyways.) Saphs B ranged does nothing important in the long run. Saphs X will be blocked or tied with 90 percent of the time. Melee wise their both the same, but ruby has the Hexagon bomb move to force Saph away from him and thus leaving itself open.

In a melee fight it's about equal and depends on the players skill. Assuming two perfect players are fighting Ruby should win because he has more effective options in melee than Saph. Saph would win in a long range fight, but because of how Ruby plays (And because of his shield) Saph will eventually get rushed down and defeated.

Also, Ruby's B shots are a bit harder to block than most other shots because of their explosiveness. They also stun longer on block and hit and may or may not move the same speed as Saphs B laser.

I'm very biased here but i still think Ruby should win in a fight against Saph. Saph would prolly win pretty much any other fight versus any other knight though.

Did i miss anything? I hope not...

[yuurei]

Wow didn't even see freezes response. That's what i get for typing leaving for a hour and coming back without reloading the page...

[Deleted]

I would say Ruby Knight because he can block all of Saphire Knight's beam attacks and Ruby Knight's explosives would finish the job.

[Carigun]

id say that ruby is a pro with explosives (which is more like suicide) and sapphire is a pro with beam shots (which i enjoy using) but if you look past that they are practical the same borg with slightly different stats.

i will go for Sapphire Knight